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Online Adult Forum Portal > Message Board > Discussion Topic: "Health Care: End-of-Life Counseling Provision Raises Furor"
 
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KenVincent
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Registered: 12/19/07
Posts: 103

    08/20/09 at 11:19 AM
  #1

The Big Questions

 

1.      Studies show that only 13 percent of Americans have a living will, a document that lays out their desires for treatment as they near death. Why do you think that number is so low?

 

2.      While people who are part of strong families have caring relatives to help them in making end-of-life decisions, what about people who have no such support group? What support is available for them?

 

3.      Why do you think some people heard the proposed advance-counseling provision as opening the door for euthanasia and "death panels" even though the provision included no such measures?

 

4.      Is end-of-life planning in any way an expression of lack of trust in God? Explain your answer.

 

5.      Ought government have any participation in end-of-life counseling, even if only funding it?

 


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Ken Vincent
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St. Luke Lutheran Church
Albuquerque, NM
WillHoffman
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Registered: 01/04/08
Posts: 98

    08/21/09 at 07:33 PM
  #2

Not able to find discussion materials.

1.  I think most people either aren't interested or don't think a living will important.

2.  We all have support groups if we want them and look for them.  This includes a variety of end-of-life organizations and serviceds ranging from Hospices to cancer survivors to Thanatopsis.

3.  Some people hear what they want to hear and then read worst-case scenarios into them.  I think that we die like we live.   I have known men who never grew up or recovered from their father wound and their anger -- who never wanted to change or look at options.  I have found others who have lived sheltered lives and just don't have much experience and coping mechanisms.

 4.  I have talked at length with care providers; how we handle the end is very personal, subjective, sometimes seemingly incomprehensible.  The way we deal with death, especially of others we love, often says more about those who continue on.  There are people, usually family members, who want to keep their love ones alive at any cost; there are some people who hang on and fight against death; and  there are others who let go when they are not fatally ill.  Trust in God is important, it is a life-long experience that grows as we grow old.

Four  examples:
i.  Men, who often struggle with the health issues of others (we want to "fix" things), can learn so much, for example, by being there for dying wives.  One I know, whose wife was felled by cancer near the end took her to a healing ceremony and told her, "Let's go forward and find healing."  She replied:  "I've already been healed."

ii.  I was the last person to speak to my dying father in the hospitsal.  I told him "We love you.  We'll be back in the morning."  He let go just after midnight, on his 50th wedding anniversary.

iii.  My mother had a massive stroke.  We took her off life-support with only comfort care.  She lived on for three days in a coma, with a strong heart.  She died after midnight, 10 years and one day after my father died.

iv.  My father's oldest sister, a spinster, was surrounded by her nieces and nephews the last four years of her life.  She was lucid and had mobility until the end.  She refused invasive medical care.  She let go at sunrise on a Monday morning, age 94.  Her will divided her cash reserve for long-term care among us six.  She told us to travel and experience the world.  Previously, she had given us her Indian art collection, books, and family momentos.  She was the last survivor of our parents' generation.  We will celebrate her parents' (our grandparents') 100th wedding anniversary next year.  She had cared for both her parents in their final years and they died a year apart.  She is buried with them and my dad and mom.

5.  Government can help be an enabler by playing a very limited role of assisting other enablers to help the dying.  It takes a village to raise a child, I think it takes a village to mourn and affirm those who have died.

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BeverlyDavies
Registered: 08/21/09
Posts: 5

    08/22/09 at 06:13 AM
  #3

1. I believe the number is low because people deny their approaching demise as well as the deaths of their loved ones.  It is only human to deny those things that disturb us.  Perhaps it is a way of avoiding acknowledging the inevitability of our deaths.
2. Our church, our spiritual mentors, our loved ones who have gone before us, our friends, our counselors and hospice providers, our doctors are all available for support if we reach out to them.
3. I believe that the topic of our approaching death is so difficult to approach, that the very decision to talk to our doctors about it brings up fear and anxiety and for some people, fear takes over their ability to sit with it  and face things.  So, we ascribe malice to those who only mean to help us approach this difficult topic.  Instead we choose to deny reality and go about as if we were invincible, denying, denying, denying.  People would rather get mad at some imagined foe instead of looking at the hard subjects. Anger is easier to bear than fear.  Fear is at the heart of all anger.
4. Government can only offer to pay for the support people need in facing these difficult decisions in the form of a discussion with a doctor or counselor or social worker.  We cannot avoid the responsibility of making these decisions for ourselves however as our life is ultimately our own responsibility.  As I understand it, the health care reform bill offered to simply pay for the conversation with the health care provider and people would have made all of the ultimate decisions themselves and euthanasia would have remained illegal and not an option ever... However, since so many people have become so scared about this, the proposal has been dropped and now we would have to pay for this opportunity to discuss things with our doctor ourselves. 

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